New Page 1

Author Topic: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.  (Read 541 times)

Online Leo 2A6

  • Global Moderator
  • Operation Supercharge
  • *****
  • Posts: 3832
  • Country: au
  • He who dies with the most toys wins
Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« on: December 27, 2016, 10:07:12 AM »
Hi All, After looking around there didn't seem to be much in the way a instruction/direction with the P IV metal suspension upgrade and some of it's pit falls. So here's a quick how to on the steps and reasons why. Hope you find this helpful. It does loosely relate to other suspension upgrades for different tanks.

1.Starting with the suspension components. Below are whats provided it the upgrade kit.
    2 halves of the swing arms
    Spring
    Retaining screw
    Hub Cap



2. The small spring fits into a recess in between the 2 halves of the swing arms. When the retaining screw is in place it acts as a pivot point
     allowing the arms to swing and recover to a set point. However I found that the (in image 3) when the RH element engages the lower leaf
     spring there is more than enough tension to allow the suspension to work.
     If there is to much tension from both the inner and leaf springs the system will act as a fixed boogie and not independent swinging arms.




     spring
   

Online Leo 2A6

  • Global Moderator
  • Operation Supercharge
  • *****
  • Posts: 3832
  • Country: au
  • He who dies with the most toys wins
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #1 on: December 27, 2016, 10:23:53 AM »
3. Fitting to the hull. I found like a few others that the metal upgrade system is narrower than the original plastic set up by up to 4.5mm
    thus setting the road wheel stations in to far towards the hull and out of centre line of the drive sprocket and idler.
    Easy fix is a couple of washer the last one on outer side to allow the retaining screw to pass through just slightly. You could also glue on
    styrene to the correct thickness and counter bore to accommodate the retaining screw.







     Suspension done, I do however recommend leaving the caps off until you're satisfied that all is working after testing, just in case you
     want/need to tweak I was happy with my set and went ahead with them fitted.
     Also a good idea to file the inner edge of the cap as they tend to be a very tight press fit if you don't get them properly seated the cause
     problems with the roads wheels.

Online Leo 2A6

  • Global Moderator
  • Operation Supercharge
  • *****
  • Posts: 3832
  • Country: au
  • He who dies with the most toys wins
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #2 on: December 27, 2016, 10:38:10 AM »
4. On to the road wheels. First thing I did was glue the 2 halves of the road wheels together then cleaned out the centre just in case any glue
    or burrs that my inhibit free spinning of the wheel. I use a drill set that has .1mm increments which makes for a clean hole without over sizing.
    All these parts are friction fitted (no Bearings) so the cleaner the better, also lubricate.

    The road wheels need a bit of attention as they are a cast item and do tend to have a few burrs and dags in the inner parts of the rim, they
    just need a little scrape with the end of a file to remove. It's also a good opportunity to remove any paint where the hub caps will seat.

    Clean out



    A couple of burrs in the inner rim



    Clean the rim



    Clean rim front and back








Online Leo 2A6

  • Global Moderator
  • Operation Supercharge
  • *****
  • Posts: 3832
  • Country: au
  • He who dies with the most toys wins
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #3 on: December 27, 2016, 11:01:30 AM »
5. Fitting the road wheels. There is a back and a front to the road wheels, Once cleaned out is fairly easy to see. Next step is a small dab of multi
    purpose grease. (I use grease as its water repellent, at the time of this upgrade this vehicle was ear marked to become a
    Landwasser Schlepper II so water was going to be an issue). Any dust or grit that may get stuck to any excess can be blown off nice and clean
    with compressed air.

    It's a good idea to fit the rubber tyres just before grease this prevents getting the grease all over unwanted parts.

    The pic below shows the difference between the inner and outer side, the wheel on the left shows the screw correctly seated to allow the
    hub cap to be fitted with interference from the screw head.



    Next step is to clean up the hub cap so it seats properly in the rim.



    Time for the grease



    I put a tiny amount of grease on the outer rim where the retaining screw seats in a recess so the wheels can spin freely but be firm on the axel.



    Next, wheels onto the axels.



    Next step is crews in and test drive.

Online Leo 2A6

  • Global Moderator
  • Operation Supercharge
  • *****
  • Posts: 3832
  • Country: au
  • He who dies with the most toys wins
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2016, 11:10:31 AM »
6. Test drive successful and happy with the results I ended up fitting 480 motors to cope with the Ostketten track to help push it through the
     grass however narrow tracks will go back on now as this is going to be a Rakenwerfer VS150 but will still be weighty which means the
     suspension will work even better.

     This test was done with the standard HL 2.4. It will be upgraded to Elmod soon.... :D



https://youtu.be/89S2txKCXLU

   This is my personal opinion/experience with these particular products and in no way should it be taken as gospel/instruction
   as there is none.
   I just hope this was some help.

Cheers Damo

Online Yobbo

  • Global Moderator
  • Operation PM
  • *****
  • Posts: 1680
  • Country: au
  • Town/City: Palmerston , N.T.
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2016, 11:41:49 AM »
Outstanding tutorial and images.
"Don't get your panties in a bunch , we still got hand weapons and the fifty".

Online Leo 2A6

  • Global Moderator
  • Operation Supercharge
  • *****
  • Posts: 3832
  • Country: au
  • He who dies with the most toys wins
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2016, 01:19:28 PM »
Cheers mate hope it will help somebody out...... ::) :D :D

Offline biff131

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 191
  • Country: au
  • Town/City: Abermain NSW
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2017, 09:41:17 AM »
Gday leo
Nice tutorial mate, did you put the little spring in or leave it out to get your suspension to work properly.
Biff   8)

Online Leo 2A6

  • Global Moderator
  • Operation Supercharge
  • *****
  • Posts: 3832
  • Country: au
  • He who dies with the most toys wins
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2017, 10:05:51 AM »
Hi biff, yeah sorry mate I didn't make that very clear did I..... ::) I left them out as it makes the suspension very stiff thus making it work more like a boogie rather than 2 independent swinging arms.

Cheers Damo :D

Offline biff131

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 191
  • Country: au
  • Town/City: Abermain NSW
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #9 on: January 12, 2017, 06:05:34 PM »
 Gday Leo
do you think replacing the spring with a softer spring benefit the workings of the suspension or does the extra weight with metal wheels and tracks give you a satisfactory mode of operation.
 ::)
Biff  8)

Online Leo 2A6

  • Global Moderator
  • Operation Supercharge
  • *****
  • Posts: 3832
  • Country: au
  • He who dies with the most toys wins
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #10 on: January 12, 2017, 07:19:57 PM »
Hey biff, 

Not really, the leaf spring is very stiff, even with the extra weight of the metal running gear it still behaves more like a boogie than
independent swing arms. I'd speculate that you could put every possible metal upgrade on this set up and still get minimal proper
swing arm action. I'd reckon based on my past experience with this kind of set up would at least carry 6Kg before you'd need to keep the inner "loop spring" (not sure of the proper term for them).. :o

Offline maxmekker

  • Able to Hull Down
  • *****
  • Posts: 678
  • Country: no
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2017, 05:24:03 AM »
Lovly watching the action of the suspension , Great writeup man

Offline thegunny

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 327
  • Country: au
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #12 on: January 23, 2017, 11:55:27 AM »
Will keep this in mind when I finally get around to finishing mine  ::)

I was thinking the same thing about the the little spring in that it appeared to make the suspension much stiffer than it needed to be.

Online Yobbo

  • Global Moderator
  • Operation PM
  • *****
  • Posts: 1680
  • Country: au
  • Town/City: Palmerston , N.T.
Re: Panzer IV Metal suspension upgrade.
« Reply #13 on: March 11, 2017, 03:16:37 PM »
Always wondered why the Germans went from brilliant torsion bar suspension on the P3 to this old horse and cart style suspension?
The designers must have had a good reason.
"Don't get your panties in a bunch , we still got hand weapons and the fifty".